BE: Mage -> Blood Mage -> Warlock?

[Nymare]

Because, like everyone else, I have a warlock alt - I have decided to do some research on Blood Elves and warlockery. Namely, I wanted to know when Blood Elves might have embraced warlockhood. I assume it is a fairly recent addition to their culture for a few reasons, which I will get to, but I will also admit to not knowing the lore beyond what is in game and on wowwiki. So, if there is a simple answer, please just tell it to me and give me a hearty STFU.

Honestly, the #1 reason this even came to me was when I was RPing my way around Silvermoon as Nymare and stopped in at the warlock guild. Unlike the Priest and Mage guilds, there are almost no books... no library of collected knowledge (which is what I assume would be in said books in said other guilds). Naturally, there are no books because they just haven't been at this long enough to have a good collection of their own - or, warlocks may just be so OP, they don't NEED to read? Ok, so, stupid reason to think "hey, mebbe we haven't been doing this forever" but it got me to check out a bit more on wowwiki.

There, it says:
Warlocks were once mages, or in case of the orcs, Shamans, who, in pursuit of ever-greater sources of power, abandoned their studies of the Arcane or Nature and delved into darker Shadow-based magic. Warlocks still retain their skills in the manipulation of the Fire element, although their focus is on delivering excruciating pain, drawing out the suffering of their victims instead of the effective application of Arcane energies to efficiently dispose of their targets from a safe distance.

Seems to me, in a society like what the Quel'Dorei had and represented, they would not bother with warlockery unless they were doing so in private or, say, they were suddenly allied with Illidan and had these big, creepy green stones hovering everywhere, feeding them fel energy and watching them undress - because being a mage would have been far 'superior' otherwise.

This led me to look at the wiki's Blood Elf Lore page. Under regular classes, they have the Lore Classes of Blood Mage and Spell Breaker. On the Blood Mage page, it is noted that:
While they were still members of the Alliance, the blood elves began to turn to the darkest parts of magic, abandoning the water and frost spells of the Kirin Tor for the fire and heat of what some people fear to be demonic magic.TFTMan 10and
Calling themselves Blood Elves - these cold hearted refugees seek to expand their remaining magical powers at any cost - even if it means courting the infernal powers of the Burning Legion.

Kael'Thas is a Blood Mage, of course, and it is perfectly acceptable to be a mage focused on fire, but fire does not equal demonic magic. I assume Warlockery would be the next step.

So, I need help here. I'm trying to write, since I have nothing else to do for the next 5.5 hours but dream of welfare epics. Does anyone have a good idea of when/how Blood Elves would have taken to being warlocks? I would check the little info box on the new character screen, but, yeah... stupid Tuesdayness...

[Hellista]

You could always fake it.

I rolled Hellista the day BC came out, and had no idea about any of the Belf Warlock lore...So I changed her. Thats why she's a death shaman. She follows her own lore based off troll culture, and it seems to be fun.

Now your warlock Nymarei, I am assuming is supposed to be the same person as Nymare, unless I'm mistaken. If this is the case, perhaps her connection to the demonic forces came from her rune trouble. Perhaps the runes opened a gateway or something to extra demonic influence, aside from the stuff she was already going through with her drives.

Just because you are a certain class doesn't mean you have to conform to the norm.

Hellista doesn't consider herself a warlock at all. Its why I try not to let anyone see me when I go train. Shhh.

Of course, if you wish to go the normal route, just disregard what I said and wait for one of the lore junkies to answer.

[Daedraug]

In theory, -all- warlocks of all races are practicing in secret and very small in number. The tabletop rpg has a specific spell list for warlocks who wish to remain hidden as mages in normal society, and seems to indicate that Thrall has a standing death order on any warlocks found within his lands.

[Nymare]

Hehehe -- I could easily leave the details of when and how their society came to have warlocks since the story's focus is meant to explain why there is an incognito Nymlock running around, but when I was imagining her initial interaction with her would-be trainer, I figured he'd give her a little history (and she notes the lack of books)... and that's where I got stuck.

Though I can leave that part out, I am still interested in knowing the when/how.

[Nymare]

In theory, -all- warlocks of all races are practicing in secret and very small in number. The tabletop rpg has a specific spell list for warlocks who wish to remain hidden as mages in normal society, and seems to indicate that Thrall has a standing death order on any warlocks found within his lands.

I gathered that from the "hidden warlock" and "uncorrupted warlock" linked terms on wowwiki, but, naturally, it just can't work for game mechanics. I assume lore was altered to accept the class.
Although traditionally considered evil, Horde and Alliance leaders have tentatively accepted them to bolster troops. Some warlocks are known as hidden warlocks and some are uncorrupted warlocks.and
Thrall has expressed discomfort with the warlocks but understands the necessities in using them.--wowwiki

And I did just find this - another reason for me to assume Blood Elf Warlocking might be a more recent addition to their repertoire:
High Elf warlocks

Some high elves turned to this path after their glorious home of Quel'Thalas was destroyed in the Third War. This new breed of warlock seeks to control the powers that ravaged their homeland and use them for vengeance.WRPG 95These few remaining high elves who are warlocks have long since become blood elves.WoWRPG 57

[Evanthe]

I assume that BE warlocks are more accepted than warlocks in other races, since they draw off fel energies anyway.

As far as how recent BE warlocks are, I'm going to say there have probably always been high elf warlocks opperating in secret, unable to resist the call of darker magic. But with the destruction of the sunwell and their turn to fel energies, BE warlocks have become more accepted in BE society, although definately not to the level of mages or rangers. (This is also suggested by the location of the warlock trainers- down murder row, definately the 'shady' part of town.) So, although there probably have been some practicing warlocks, most are fairly new to it, and the established warlock guild is almost certainly new.

[Roth'rili]

I would have to agree the quote on the high elf warlock pretty much covers a lot of it. I don't believe every single elf caster was a goodie twoshoe, got to have your Dar'Khans in the mix that drifted to power over traditional Kirin Tor teachings. Now I believe though that with the razing of Silvermoon and the drive of many Sin'Dorei craving revenge forced a turn to more apparently destructive abilities to dispose of their enemy. Also Kael'thas pretty much made fire a symbolism for the Sin'dorei people representing the feiry pheonix which dies but is reborn from its ashes. So destructive magic like fire is welcome in their society and as I see it those that go the path of the warlock seek joy in using the the powers used agaist them back agaist their enemy. (Most of what I can see Blood elves since the downfall have taken up "Keep your friends close your enemies closer" feel and master in the arts of their enemies to throw their same magic back. Spell Breakers in the RTS for example)

Now with the books I don't think any warlock guilds even have them, I mean a few but go around each warlock trainer hub. Nothing but devices to help them learn and control their art but no reading material. I've been to them all in my time of playing WoW, SW, IF, Org, SM, each hub as very scarce selection of books compared to and mage hubs. And being a warlock and doing the quest chains it really shows that you either have the strength to control your power or you don't survival of the fittest. My theorycraft is that its a trial through error if your not strong enough to control the powers you die simple, no reading can help you with that I think and I don't think any of the warlock leaders care about your life.

In Silvermoon I think warlocks are more accepted in their society using the enemey agaist the enemy. Providing demons to siphon mana which Sin'dorei believe is a guiltless crime, who care about demons? No one *siphon magic* Though I think the still might be shunned by thoughs that stick to traditions, non fire mages and the rangers. Could be the reason why they prefer the seclusion in murder row no one from those casts are going to come over start crap. I think with the acceptance of the warlocks is on par with acceptance of the Blood Knights, they are new they are change and people are not always welcome to that.

[Qabian]

Scholomance always had high elf warlocks, or at least high elf bad shadow people. I'm sure among the people Kel'thuzad managed to weasel into the Cult of the Damned from Dalaran, Stratholme, wherever else, there were some high elves.

Warlocks have always been bad guys, but desperate times, yes?

Kael'thas is a Blood Mage, but he is doing very bad things. With demons. Like the spellbreakers and regular soldiers, I'd guess the class is assumed to be not numerous enough to warrant regular player character versions, i.e. for the sake of game balance, woo.

[EnheilRas]

Blood Elves probably learned warlock magicks 10,000 years ago methinks.

[Nymare]

It's not a matter so much of when they learned it, but when they accepted it... but I suppose my answer lies in the fact that most warlocks of other races, as well, were "accepted" after the last war, due to the supposed desire of the people involved to use the Legion's magic against the Legion out of a desire for vengeance.

Orcs would probably have the most and varied knowledge on the subject, but I think Roth is right... not a whole lot of literature floating around those warlock guilds. Most are basements anyway.

Poor Nym. She desires books!


So, next question - Where might she go to to look for warlocky books/information to better hone her warlockery goodness?

[Evanthe]

The library in Dire Maul is often used by players looking for warlock magic. I'm sure Scholomance would have extensive books, too. Shadowfang Keep has a library, and the library in Scarlet Monestary might have something (assuming the crusaders seek knowledge about the scrouge, burning legion and their powers that this might extend to warlocks).

Information? Other warlocks.

[Roth'rili]

Warlocks have so many quest lines its amazing they really go into how they do this and that to where she on her growth in power will keep learning. Like the warlock hub in Ratchet are some the more potent warlock teachers as you start getting sent to them for varies learning ness. Evanthe might be able to give more info about how warlocks progress since there is SO many warlock quests (more then any other class I think?). Really I think its a gots to learn it yourself thing and many locks don't reveal anything they have learned unless you have shown considerable power.

But books on warlock information...wow thats a tough one ummmmmm. Fudge I wouldn't know but since warlock arts are a fraction of magery the basics of fire magic will easily be found with in libaries of mages. Maybe even RP finding a enclave of the libary that holds tomes of darker arts. (I mean they would have books of it to learn what those arts are and how to avoid them right?) Orcs are by far the best well of warlock information I would thing, anythign that can be found in their area in the city or any old sites of warlock history in outlands (though I think your lock can't go to outlands yet). Mostly I think in the deep rescess of every mages mind they know the dark arts so they gots the books somewhere!

Edit: After Evanthe's comment. Those places I would assume are a well of information for shadowmagic, Scholomance though I see more of a information hub for shadow and necromancy which equals control of undead and not demons. Really it can be a adventurer your a lock and info in everything you do is spread the hell out. Books on how to control your fire and make it more devasting can probably be found in any mage library. Shadow arts can probably be found in the place Evanthe mentioned with maybe some demonology. I still say if you can find some creative way of grabbing info from orcs that been controling and working with demons for centuries is a nice way to find info for demonolgy.

[Tillna]

Shiggy could inform you on different aspects, but thi is a blank in my lore-dar

[EnheilRas]

They learned it when they were Highborne. Their whole exile was because they didn't want to give up their magic and warlockness.

[Qabian]

That's true. That whole Well of Eternity/War of the Ancients thing? They were summoning demons. They just sucked at it, I think. Back then the knowledge base for demon work was extremely primitive, as I understand it. The only reason they could do it was because they had one massive source of power in one place, and specific instructions. They've come such a long way. Awww.

[Thalevia]

Because there are so few books around the games warlock areas I just think of warlocking as largely an oral tradition. You learn from each other, nothing is written, left over from when warlocks had to be 100% hidden from the general populace to remain alive and practicing.

[EnheilRas]

The Orcs were the first masters of Warlock Magick. The Elves were just wreckless (As were the Humans they taught) with magic. They had no discipline or focus. The Orcs were the first to take the Magic and really ensorcell it to fashion necromancy.

[Aquizit]

Oh! Good, a specialty of mine.

Firstly, I'd like to think that the culture of the Blood Elves currently is a mix of desperation, addiction to magic, and nostalgia for the glory days. To me, that seems like a rather dangerous combination. That would explain unstable willpower and the psychological means to turn to what an elf might think necessary to control his addiction or to find the ability to fight back against his enemies more potently.

As for the books, look at each and every warlock trainer area in the game, Humans, Orcs, Blood Elves, Forsaken have no books even close to them, I think the gnomes have one little bookshelf in the house they're in. Why? Why would you leave such damning evidence so easily attainable? This is an oral society, as books can only be found by those who would exile or kill you.

As for the High Elves in Scholomance, those are Necromancers, not Warlocks. Hence the name of the place, School of Necromancy. The Shadow they wield is different, I think. Warlocks pull from the Void, Shadow Priests pull from the darkness in people's souls. It's hard to explain the Shadow that necromancer's wield, but that's another topic anyway.

Now, why did the Blood Elves become warlocks?

In Aquizit's case, for Control. He wanted to control his addiction and what better way to do that than to breach the Nether, one to draw from the raw power within, and another to take from it a being of power that he controls. Bending a creature to your will is an amazing ego amplifying feature, I think. How did he learn of the craft in the first place? Well, although there are very few books on Warlocks and the arts, of course there are some. Many warlock quests have you get a book of some sort. Aquizit was a mage's apprentice in Dalaran before the fall, and survived the collapse by being out in the mountains when it happened, doing some humdrum task for his master. He came back to find the city in ruins, and surviving mages and wizards in disarray at what happened. In such a case, it's easy to find a stray book kept hidden by one of the high wizards, and thus.. he learned.

Really, some do it to sate the hunger for magic. Some do it because like most wizards turned warlocks, they think they can control their demons, that they are better than the others. Some feel they need to just to survive, since the paranoia of the blood elves is paramount, that the world has turned against them once, how can it not again? Also, it's a good RP angle to be wary of the Horde.. another potential Garithos.

Again, Aquizit turned to the Fel arts to control his addiction, and to summon and Control the power that might save his people. He knows of the Traitor Prince and his bargain with the Legion. So what irony if he twisted the forces that Kael'thas is working with to defeat him..


My two copper.

[EnheilRas]

those are Necromancers, not Warlocks.

http://www.wearoftherodent.com/products/images/30/objection_zoom.jpg

Necromancy is a School of Warlock Magic, as Defined in WarCraft II.

[Anthek]

http://www.wearoftherodent.com/products/images/30/objection_zoom.jpg

Necromancy is a School of Warlock Magic, as Defined in WarCraft II.

Not necessarily. Kel'thuzad was a mage, not a warlock, but put some study into necromancy without the use of fel magic, and with some success.

[EnheilRas]

Did I say you had to be a Warlock to use Necromancy? I don't recall saying that.

[Sinthe]

You pretty much implied it by saying necromancers were a type of warlock.

[Aquizit]

Ah, you refer to the original Deathknights, I believe, Manus? There I believe there is a difference. While I do believe that the manipulation of souls is indeed a Warlock trait, to which Gul'dan brought back the orc souls into other bodies, I believe that the reanimation of a body -without- a soul is an Arcane talent, and more Necromancy.

The Forsaken, you say? Kel'thuzad? All undead with souls you say?

Yes. BUT! this method of Necromancy was drawn up by Demons, the Nathrezim.. masters of soul manipulation.

So, yes, Manus... you have a point.. but your Objection thing there is indeed implying that ALL necromancers were warlocks, which is not the case. Gul'dan's deathknights? Yes, warlock arts. The Scourge, yes.. created by demonic means. A rogue mage robbing crypts and raising skeleton minions? No. No soul manipulation in it.

[Qabian]

Re: Scholo - Don't forget the Blood Steward. She's not dead. But yeah, that's a good point. It's a Necromancy school, not a warlock demony place. Still, bad demon things + Highborne do have a multi-millennia long history.

[EnheilRas]

A School of Warlock Magic!