Human Claymores Now Spark Chains ala Bomberman.

[Daala]

Seed of Corruption will explode whenever the target takes a total of 1044 damage from one or more sources. It only damages opponents. The damage from the explosion will count toward the 1044 damage of another target, should one be nearby. Think about that for a bit.

That was posted by Tseric on the Warlock forums. I love any Blue comment that ends "think about that," particularly on a class forum. To say the least I'm looking forward to PvP and (situationally) raid application.

[Pythre-Co]

Although that is an awesome spell, my perverted mind keeps laughing at it. :cry:

[Fhenrir]

I don't get it. He worded that really badly, can someone clarify for me?

[Daala]

It sounds like he said that once SoC is applied, it will detonate when the target takes 1044 damage. Not 1044 from SoC, just 1044 damage. This will consume the spell, nullifying the DoT, but activating the massive direct damage. I'm not sure if the direct damage applies to the recipient of the SoC spell.

Also, it is possible to apply SoC to multiple targets. Say, three enemies all have it. Everybody whales on one, deals 1044 damage, and SoC detonates, damaging enemy two and three for 1110-1290, because they're within 15 yards. This will damage enemy two and three sufficiently to set off their SoC. Two will damage One and Three for the same amount, and Three will damage One and Two. It's an obscenely quick way of dealing thousands of damage to several targets at once, provided they're in the same area and the effect isn't dispelled.

To counter the dispel possibility, the warlock also applies Unstable Affliction. For those that missed this in the update revision, this spell now silences the dispeller for 5 seconds in addition to nuking them.

[Marroc]

See the problem is you need to get it cast on all of them...

With spell reflection for warriors, and the new cheat death in the rogue talents, it's going to be VERY hard to use it like this.

It also eats up one of your other dot spots, which in all honestly will probably be doing more DoT-wise than this spell (ie. will do like 2k over the course of the dot instead of a 1k dot and a 1k direct damage).

Also, if a Rogue is lucky enough he could get a cheat death proc on the direct damage part, run up and kill you before you could get it back on him.

It's actually really well balanced, but I can see it being needed in a lot of mass mob fights (imagine Jin'do but with thousands of lil shades).

[Shadowspeak]

I don't get it. He worded that really badly, can someone clarify for me?

seed... exploded....

[Daala]

It also eats up one of your other dot spots, which in all honestly will probably be doing more DoT-wise than this spell (ie. will do like 2k over the course of the dot instead of a 1k dot and a 1k direct damage).
-Huh? None of our DoT's do nearly 2k. Right now, the most DoT damage is Curse of Affliction, which is 1044, just like Seed. Corruption, without finding the training tome, is 666. The question of viability is whether or not Seed's direct damage afflicts the original target. But even then, it's a two second cast. If everybody else is whaling on the target, it won't take long to do about a thousand damage. I alone could do it in 5 seconds with no DoT's and two Shadowbolts. Keep re-applying Seed, and your DPS goes through the roof. By the time the target's dead, the proximates could very reasonably have taken two or three thousand damage from Seed alone.

Your PvP examples are very good for duelling, but for group PvP, I don't feel they apply so much, especially in the chaos of an Alterac brawl, or last ditch combat in a Warsong flag room. So many things going on at once, it's going to be very hard to time when to shield against the spell. If the burst activates at total damage received, you can't reliably look at the 18 second spell life and expect that to be anywhere close to the moment of detonation if a single person, including the warlock who cast the Seed, is attacking you.

[Marroc]

It also eats up one of your other dot spots, which in all honestly will probably be doing more DoT-wise than this spell (ie. will do like 2k over the course of the dot instead of a 1k dot and a 1k direct damage).
-Huh? None of our DoT's do nearly 2k. Right now, the most DoT damage is Curse of Affliction, which is 1044, just like Seed. Corruption, without finding the training tome, is 666. The question of viability is whether or not Seed's direct damage afflicts the original target. But even then, it's a two second cast. If everybody else is whaling on the target, it won't take long to do about a thousand damage. I alone could do it in 5 seconds with no DoT's and two Shadowbolts. Keep re-applying Seed, and your DPS goes through the roof. By the time the target's dead, the proximates could very reasonably have taken two or three thousand damage from Seed alone.
You're forgetting the next 2-4 ranks of every dot you'll be getting...


Your PvP examples are very good for duelling, but for group PvP, I don't feel they apply so much, especially in the chaos of an Alterac brawl, or last ditch combat in a Warsong flag room. So many things going on at once, it's going to be very hard to time when to shield against the spell. If the burst activates at total damage received, you can't reliably look at the 18 second spell life and expect that to be anywhere close to the moment of detonation if a single person, including the warlock who cast the Seed, is attacking you.
... spell REFLECTION... You cast it on a warrior... the warrior tosses it back on you... Now who's in trouble?

Also Cheat death works just fine in group pvp 20% chance to completely nulify the killing blow against the rogue... And with the new rogue abilities that one chance is all we will need.

It's a stong move to be sure, but your giving it too much credit. There are several abilities that can and will nulify it... Nevermind that the average health of a level 70 warrior will be over 8k and a rogue will have close to 6k (following standard progression of +stm gear and regular hp increase per level).

Its not an I win button, but it is a devistating attack if it's used correctly. No one knows exactly how anything is going to work, but I can assure you Blizzard has thought of this (All signs of the expansion point to the fact that they have said FU to vavendi and are making TBC their way now.) I can assure you their will be a counter, be it a 4000 damage Greater shadow protection potion, or armor that has spell reflection on it. Everything they have added and will add later has a counter, they just haven't told us all of them yet.

[Aquizit]

Man, hunters better get something as kick-ass... I swear to freakin' God..

[Fhenrir]

/poke Zust and Shadowspeak

I got the perversion involved with it, I didn't understand what the actual spell effect was.

Thank you for clarifying, Daala.

[Daala]

It's a stong move to be sure, but your giving it too much credit. There are several abilities that can and will nulify it... Nevermind that the average health of a level 70 warrior will be over 8k and a rogue will have close to 6k (following standard progression of +stm gear and regular hp increase per level).

Its not an I win button, but it is a devistating attack if it's used correctly. No one knows exactly how anything is going to work, but I can assure you Blizzard has thought of this (All signs of the expansion point to the fact that they have said FU to vavendi and are making TBC their way now.) I can assure you their will be a counter, be it a 4000 damage Greater shadow protection potion, or armor that has spell reflection on it. Everything they have added and will add later has a counter, they just haven't told us all of them yet.Hmm? I never thought it would be an I-Win button. Far from it. If I gave that impression, that wasn't my intent. I just thought this was cool and unprecedented.

As for reflection, I know what that word means. I know it probably wasn't your intent, but I find defining reflection a little patronizing. But again, in a dynamic environment it'll be hard to necessarily know a Seed is flying towards you. Not to mention if another caster is attacking the warrior with their own set of spells. Cheat death. I mentioned dynamic environment because for the Rogue to kill the warlock after avoiding the spell, he/she'd first have to get to the warlock, then beat the warlock. Rogues are very close-quarters, and Warlocks have fear, which gives us the edge if we can see the Rogue coming. Odds are there will be plenty of people on both sides of the encounter, so there are many other variables to consider.

And I'm not forgetting the next ranks. But damage isn't going to jump a thousand points for ten levels worth of ranks. Even if it did, it would be damage over so much time that the odds of the spell living its natural life before A) target dies, or B) target is dispelled are very slim.

You're very welcome, Fhenrir!

[Marroc]

Hmm? I never thought it would be an I-Win button. Far from it. If I gave that impression, that wasn't my intent. I just thought this was cool and unprecedented. Sry, thats my reading from the WoW forums carrying over... everyone thinks it is...


As for reflection, I know what that word means. I know it probably wasn't your intent, but I find defining reflection a little patronizing. But again, in a dynamic environment it'll be hard to necessarily know a Seed is flying towards you. Not to mention if another caster is attacking the warrior with their own set of spells. Cheat death. I mentioned dynamic environment because for the Rogue to kill the warlock after avoiding the spell, he/she'd first have to get to the warlock, then beat the warlock. Rogues are very close-quarters, and Warlocks have fear, which gives us the edge if we can see the Rogue coming. Odds are there will be plenty of people on both sides of the encounter, so there are many other variables to consider.
Again, a lot of people don't realize the implications of the spell actually reflecting, I was just clarifying... no intention to insult ^_^


And I'm not forgetting the next ranks. But damage isn't going to jump a thousand points for ten levels worth of ranks. Even if it did, it would be damage over so much time that the odds of the spell living its natural life before A) target dies, or B) target is dispelled are very slim.
ya but if you factor in the new gear it could quite possibly happen.

As a side not a blue did confirm that it takes the spot of a warlocks curse on a target.

[Daala]

No worries!




ya but if you factor in the new gear it could quite possibly happen.

As a side not a blue did confirm that it takes the spot of a warlocks curse on a target.

Eh..I still don't know about 2k, but it'll be one of those "wait and see" things. Though it seems to have changed, devs were saying that 60-70 should take as much time as 1-60. So just how powerful are 70's going to be? A DoT could very well be more than 2k with gear at such a level.

Can you link this blue confirmation? I haven't seen anything about it. Seed of Corruption is taking the spot of Corruption, not a curse, from everyting I've seen.

[Marroc]

I'll see if I can dig it up, it was a while ago, someone was bitching about having like 5 lock DoTs on them being over powered... I'll see if I can find the link.

edit:
>_< can't seem to find it, so perhaps they changed it or I was hulucinating, but I'm pretty sure it counts as a curse...

edit edit:
AHA! I WAS right... They changed it.

The spell now reads:

Seed of Corruption - Rank 1
Requires Level 70
882 Mana30 yd range
2 sec cast
Imbeds a demon seed in the enemy target, causing 1044 Shadow damage over 18 sec. When the target takes 1044 total damage, the seed will inflict 1110 to 1290 Shadow damage to all enemies within 15 yards of the target. Only one Corruption spell per Warlock can be active on any one target.

used to say somthing about it eating up a curse slot, but I guess they changed it so a Warlock can only have one of them going at a time.

[Daala]

Eh, that just means Corruption won't co-exist with it, and whether that will matter or not will depend on whether SoC's direct damage affects the initial target.

[Lelenia]

...so since it can be only one corruption per target per warlock...does that mean you can only have one seed of corruption active at a time? From that wording, it tells me that if you have four warlocks, you can throw four seeds on the same target, one from each 'lock. So if you all spam Seed, the damage builds up quickly, even without others wailing on it. Now, if you are allowed to throw Seed on more than one target...then the same four locks can drop four seeds on each target...though I don't think you'd squeeze off more than three sets before the first would detonate, chaining the others. With said amounts, that'd be 14364 damage for each of the seeded targets (1044 to set off the seeds, then the minimum of 1110 per seed (4), plus the detonates from the other targets (1110x4=4440x3=13320)), followed by 9990 damage to all mobs within the collective range of the bombs...and that number is with the minimum set amount of damage, without any talents/+dmg gear. This would be most effective in crowd-control situations...such as saying "locks, seed the enemy warriors", or in PVE, "seed the (instert mob name)", since it'd give time for the tickers to build up the damage, leaving time to seed as many targets as possible.

In following, if said calculations are true....NERF WARLOCKS!

[Daala]

My interpretation is that they're applying Curse mechanics to Corruption and SoC. You can put only ONE curse on any mob. But, if you're fighting two mobs, you can curse both of them. Also, other warlocks can also curse an already cursed mob. So, four warlocks on one enemy means four curses on one enemy.

It sounds like it's the same with SoC. But, that's completely speculative. We'll ultimately see.

Now, some things to keep in mind.

1) We don't know if the target of SoC takes the direct damage.

2) The direct damage would almost certainly consume SoC, halting the DoT damage. If the 1044 detonater comes mostly from other characters attacking the target, and SoC target avoids the direct, and any other mobs are in range at the time of cast but not at the time of detonation, then it's possible SoC only deals, say, 400, which is worse than a shadowbolt.

I think that it could very well be a nightmare. UNDER THE CURRENT MINDSET. Think about raid bosses that apply bombs. There's one in MC that does it (forget who.) Whoever's got the ticking bomb runs away from everybody else. It'd be the same way with SoC. If the direct damage doesn't affect the target, then that's 1044 tops from SoC alone, which is NOT the end of the world.

This spell is too expensive to spam indefinitely. Maybe two or three times, but that's a ton of mana. I also think that more than two warlocks won't apply it to the same target in PvP, because it's way too easy for that one target to just run away. Might have to be VERY quickly, sure, but there's still risk.

For the record, I really hope the target doesn't take the direct. I do think that that's overpowered. But I think that this isn't the apocalypse some are putting it out to be. I think is balanced.

But then again, I think there's more cause to cry "Nerf Seed of Corruption" than there is to cry "Nerf Unstable Affliction." Those folks really irk me.

[Fallacy]

Hot damn, imagine having four warlocks in WSG, and all of them placing that on the opposing flag carrier.

[Marroc]

Hot damn, imagine having four warlocks in WSG, and all of them placing that on the opposing flag carrier.

aye, but try to get them all withen casting range long enough and all be alive... People will pick up on that trick real quick like.